I have a friend that has a 2.9l v6 old body style ranger, with all 4x4 components attached. I have a 1993 2.3l 2x4. How hard would it be to put the 4x4 tranny, transmission case, front axle, rear axles, and put the 4x4 shifter in. I mean, im sure this has been done before, i can get the parts, the ranger that i could get has a blown engine, and frame, chassis, and everything else looks great.. what do you guys think? is it an endevour i should embark on? or is it too much of a hassle, like trying to add air conditioning ( im still working on that one )

thanks guys,
Eli-

It would be awful. The engine crossmember is different between 4wd and 2wd Rangers, so you'd have to remove both engines, cut each crossmember out, and weld/rivet/bolt it into your truck. A solid axle swap would be easier.

Well, are there any rangers with 4 wheel drive, whos tranny/transfer case would bolt up? does anyone make a kit? I would think this has beed done before. -Thanks fast.
-Eli

The problem isn't the transmission/transfer case. It's the engine crossmember, which is critical for bolting in the 4wd front axle.

What exactly is differnt about the crossmembers? Ive seen a guy do it on a 89 ranger and he still drives it today, its been like that for atleast 2 yrs. with out any problems.

Originally posted by GRASSHOPPER
What exactly is differnt about the crossmembers? Ive seen a guy do it on a 89 ranger and he still drives it today, its been like that for atleast 2 yrs. with out any problems.

Have you seen the difference in I-Beams and Traction Beams? I'm not very familiar with I-beam rangers, but I'm sure clearance is a big issue.

Grasshopper, did he convert to TTB or a straight axle? A solid axle wouldn't present these issues. With TTB, there's a lot more to contend with (and you'd end up with a generally inferior system for wheeling).

I guess that could be a issue and when the buddy of mine did his he did add a 3" susp. lift at the same time so maybe you have a point there. If and when I do my conversion I will already have a 2" susp. lift so I hope Ill be ok. He also used all 89 stock 4x4 frt susp. parts.

Heres a qiuck way to see the crossmembers arnt differnt (atleast on 92 model year) I just called the local dealer who I deal with every day (Im a parts Manager by day) I asked them to check and see if the crossmember on a 92 2wd truck is the same as a 4wd and they said that in 92 there is only one crossmember for the truck no matter if its 2wd or 4wd so I think that would prove they are the same animal.

Sounds like they looked up the transmission crossmember.

Nope it was the engine crossmember hes actaully faxing copies of the complete frt susp. of both to me know with the pn#'s of all related parts. .....Ok Ive got the actaull ford parts brake down in frt. of me as I type this...There is no differnce in the crossmember (remember this is a 92 model yr.) and the only differnce in the parts are the mounts at the end of the I beams, the 2wd is stuck up alittle fruther and is a differnt pn# and thats on both sides at the ends of the beams to the frame. the crossmember is the same guys. So from what Im looking at from Ford the only thing you would need to change is the mounts for the I beams and thats it. Id be more then willing to fax a copy to anyone who wants it so you can see for yourself.

I've asked for a little help on this from some other people. The info you've got goes against everything I've ever checked relating to the 2wd/4wd differences, but you're obviously also checking your facts carefully. Hopefully we can get to the bottom of this without too much trouble.

Yes, i want to get to the bottom of this, I have a 93, grasshopper, is there anyway you could check that out too? I know its a new body style. but i dont know about all the suspension parts.. I have everything i need off of a 1989 4x4, for my 93 2x4...

Awesome, i want to do this..
Thanks,
-Eli

Originally posted by fastpakr
Grasshopper, did he convert to TTB or a straight axle? A solid axle wouldn't present these issues. With TTB, there's a lot more to contend with (and you'd end up with a generally inferior system for wheeling).

Generally inferior? Unless you are doing the Rubicon, the TTB will take you anywhere you want to go.

hey guys..... whats a TTB? hahaha, i really dont know, im new to all this conversion stuff :)

-Eli

TTB= Twin Traction Beam (4x4)

TIB= Twin I beam (2wd)

Here is where the diff lies. ON THE DIFF SIDE.
I don't have any actual pictures but I do have this.
http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/12/web/228000-228999/228908_347_full.jpg

In that case your going to need like 10" of lift just to clear the diff. It's bad enough that most of the Econo kits use a plate to drop the bracket, imagine what that X-member would do to the diff.

Now how you would want to mount the TTB Beam would be a custom Job to the T. No easy way about it here.

Then again if it was an F-150 Ranger and your going from a TIB to the D44 TTB. THEN and only THEN would it be a direct swap, you would even be able to use the same drop brackets.

JH

If you just change the mounting brackets on both ends of the TIB'S TO THE TTB'S IT WILL BOLT RIGHT IN.

grasshopper look at them schematics, see the crossmember the brackets are bolted to? see how the top one has a different shape to it then the bottom one? thats because the bottom one has a contour to match where your differential is. Yes they might bolt in if you swap the brackets, but your gonna piece the differential on that crossmember the first bump you hit. Who ever is telling you that there the same, is sadly mistaken, and blowing smoke up your wazzue.

also note in the picture where there is that brake line wich should be relocated, ill be damned how it hasnt been crimped off yet. See how the x member there has a curve in it to allow for the differential to tuck up and into, on the 2wd the pivot is about where the differential needs to be thus there is no contoured section. There are two different crossmembers. only way the 2wd crossmember will work is if your extremely ballsy with a torch.


http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/7/web/283000-283999/283471_211_full.jpg

Heres a front view where you can notice the differences between the pumpkin side and the non-pumpkin side of the crossmember. Note how on teh passengers side ther crossmeber forms a nice angle and is fairly bulky, while on the drivers side it just curves upwards and is much more streamlined.
http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/7/web/283000-283999/283471_115_full.jpg

Remeber, I have the old x-member, I have the whole 4x4 truck, except for the engine.. Can i mount the old cross member on to the 2wd frame? I do have both 4x4 and 2x4 cross members, i would think that the frames would have to be the same!?!?

-Eli

This sounds crazy, but the challange tickles my curiosity

-Eli ( i dont know how i got that gay face in my previous post )

could just swap your body onto the 4x4 frame and save alot more work. Or better yet if the gen 1 body is still good jsut slap a new v6 into the engine, them 2.9L are common

Theres no fun in that guys!!

Could you just cut out a clearence area in the old cross member? and reinforce it on the upper side, it may be shotty. But this cant be that bad.

-Eli

Originally posted by DownSouthTAS
Generally inferior? Unless you are doing the Rubicon, the TTB will take you anywhere you want to go.

So you're saying given two possible swaps, knowing the purpose of the swap is wheeling, that you'd put the TTB on even ground? In this case the TTB would be more difficult. A straight axle swap done right will flex better and be more stable off road than the ttb would. I don't claim that the TTB sucks like a lot of people (and I don't have any intention of getting rid of it in the short term) but yes, for wheeling it is inferior. It makes compromises to generate the better driveability that it gains.

So how hard would it be to do a straight axle swap... Does this mean no chance on the 4x4? or do i just need to stick with the 2x4?

-Eli

All I can say to back up my findings is what Ford is telling me. There is only ONE crossmeber weather its 2wd or 4wd in the 92 ranger w/a 2.3l engine. Ive spoke to both the parts side and the service side of the Ford Direct Service Center (not just the dealer). I also have a connection to the ford Dealer direct system (the same one ford dealers use) and there all the same one there to. So I geuss Ill find out how differnt they really are once I start my swap. But even still all the info Im getting is coming from Ford Tech's and there Ford Direct connection on the web.

Alright this is bugging the living sh!! out of me so I just went outside and took my 92 2wd ext Ranger and parked it beside a 91 ext. 4x4 Ranger that has a 2.9l engine in it. There is a differnce in the crossmembers and I called ford back to see what the hell is going on and they cant seem to give me a answer to tell me way the visual insp. is differnt from what there stuff tells them. I can see a differnce on the driver side of the cross member at the spot where the TTB's carrier is, know on my buddys truck that he did he did add a 3" lift at the same time witch would explain way it worked for him. Theres like a 2" differnce in clearnce between the 2wd and the 4wd member. So I still think it can and has been done but there would need to be a lift installed at the same time to give you clearnce for the carrier. Im thinking to be safe for offroad go with a 4" min. lift for clearnce. I also just called the guy who I know did his and he did say he changed the 2 mounts at the end of the beams.

you do realise the engine crossmeber goes from convex to concave shaped on that corner, your talking a good 4 inch indent. youll need more then 4.

Originally posted by fastpakr
So you're saying given two possible swaps, knowing the purpose of the swap is wheeling, that you'd put the TTB on even ground? In this case the TTB would be more difficult. A straight axle swap done right will flex better and be more stable off road than the ttb would. I don't claim that the TTB sucks like a lot of people (and I don't have any intention of getting rid of it in the short term) but yes, for wheeling it is inferior. It makes compromises to generate the better driveability that it gains.

Yes, I realize that, and I also mentioned the need to evaluate one's offroad needs and wants. That makes a big difference, whether or not it is harder. I wouldn't swap in a solid axle unless I felt I needed one; I don't. Which is why I'm putting a D35 in place of my D28, instead of putting a full-width 44 under it.

Originally posted by DownSouthTAS
Yes, I realize that, and I also mentioned the need to evaluate one's offroad needs and wants. That makes a big difference, whether or not it is harder. I wouldn't swap in a solid axle unless I felt I needed one; I don't. Which is why I'm putting a D35 in place of my D28, instead of putting a full-width 44 under it. Witch D35 are you going to use? Im going to go look at a Jeep Cherokke's frt. axle (D30 I believe) for a possible swap but havent fully looked at the idea yet (aka width and mounting).

Project 4x4 (http://www.offroadrangers.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=15798) :nuts:


i've converted, it's cake ;) what do you wanna know

Originally posted by GRASSHOPPER
Witch D35 are you going to use? Im going to go look at a Jeep Cherokke's frt. axle (D30 I believe) for a possible swap but havent fully looked at the idea yet (aka width and mounting).

I'm going to use the D35 Twin Traction Beam, which will, in a nutshell, bolt right up in place of the D28. If you look at a Cherokee axle, make sure it doesn't have the vacuum hubs on it.

pioneers dont have the vacuum differential, there is no hubs on the jeep 30's persay. its one large wheel bearing unit. Also older base models dont have the unlocking differential.