I'll be dropping a 351W into a Gen 1 Ranger soon, trying to get parts lined up. Some people have recommended to me using the stock 2.9 mounts with plates of 1/4" steel as described here

http://members.aol.com/MREPRODUCT/ranger.htm#V8_conversion

I've searched this site and see lots and lots and lots of discussion on the Mustang mounts.

I'll have a 3" body lift, stock exhaust manifolds of some sort (that's another thread in itself). But I'm having a hard time determining which is better, stock mounts and plates or Mustang mounts?? Can anyone provide reasons why one approach would be better than the other for my application? I've heard rumor it's easier to position the motor with the plates.

I've searched but haven't found anything which clearly discusses the pros and cons of each. If I missed something post a link and flame away, I'm a newbie here.

No need to flame. Not much of that on this particular board. Welcome.

I'd recommend the 'vert mounts, but that is all I have experience with. I do know that they will get your engine as low down and as far back as you need to go.

Pros of the vert mounts are:
- they're cheap & readily available.
- mine took me 1/2 hour to install, once I had them bolted to the motor and marked the crossmember.
- You can upgrade to any aftermarket Mustang mount.
- The way they're designed, even if the rubber would fail, you won't have a motor flopping around in your engine compartment.
- There is no fabricating, other than drilling a couple holes in the crossmember.


Driver side.
http://www.smalltowncustoms.com/truck/5.0%20swap%20in%20progress/thumbs/tn_med_DriverSideMountInstalled.JPG

Passenger side.
http://www.smalltowncustoms.com/truck/5.0%20swap%20in%20progress/thumbs/tn_med_PassengerSideMountInstalled.JPG

Holes slotted for mounts. (large elongated holes near top of crossmember)
http://www.smalltowncustoms.com/truck/5.0%20swap%20in%20progress/thumbs/tn_med_MustangMountHolesSlotted.JPG


Or, you could spend $150+ on set of L&L mounts, the only advantage being that they will set your engine back another inch.

Good luck!

I'm assuming that your truck is a 4x4, so my best advice is to forget what Kevin just said. LOL (J/K Kevin!)

I am running plates & lowered 2.9L mounts in my 2wd w/o any probs. However, the crossmember under the engine is quite a bit wider in a 4x4 than a 2wd and with the Mustang mounts I'm afraid your oil pan will hit the rear I-beam pivot bracket. A guy over at the Rangerstation tried to use my El Cheapo mounts and had this very problem. He ended up just making a few little spacers and everything fit fine, but he recommended that anybody else just use the flat plates off the 2.9L mounts w/o lowering them in the engine cradle like I did. Hop over there and check it out.

I used the Mustang mounts and I am completely happy with them. I have heard many others use the plate steel method and have nothing but good things to say about them too.

The only thing I can think of to put the Mustang mount over the plate system would be the ability to use any mount for a Mustang. Mainly the poly mounts or even solid mounts. If one so desired that is. But most motors, mine included, won't need that kind of hardware.

Kevin and Pine, thank you. I read several threads where you guys discussed engine location in great detail, and it helped me a lot. It was all regarding the Mustang mounts and so I was wondering about the plates which others have recommended to me.

JP, I never considered the xmembers being different. Yes, the truck is a 4wd, but the SAS is coming before the motor swap...............so I won't have to worry about pivot brackets but I will still need to worry about the bare 4x4 xmember. Speaking of, I dunno if my rear sump 351 truck pan will interfere; have also heard conflicting info there. If I have xmember interference I'm more likely to trim it/box it or just build a new one entirely............the 351 dual sump kit is nice but I'm trying to keep this a budget build.

I tried using a rear sump pan from the 302 E150 van in my 2X2. It wouldn't clear the crossmember. If your crossmember is bigger than what I have, I highly doubt it.

'stang vert mounts are the best way to go IMO. ...roughly 40$ for the pair.

I tried using a rear sump pan from the 302 E150 van in my 2X2. It wouldn't clear the crossmember. If your crossmember is bigger than what I have, I highly doubt it.
Seems like when I tried the truck pan,on my 2wd, it cleared the X member, but contacted the twin I beam axle behind it. May work on a 4x4.

Seems like when I tried the truck pan,on my 2wd, it cleared the X member, but contacted the twin I beam axle behind it. May work on a 4x4.

Yeah, your right Dave. That is what it hit. My bad. The memory is a little rusty.

I'm assuming that your truck is a 4x4, so my best advice is to forget what Kevin just said. LOL (J/K Kevin!)

I am running plates & lowered 2.9L mounts in my 2wd w/o any probs. However, the crossmember under the engine is quite a bit wider in a 4x4 than a 2wd and with the Mustang mounts I'm afraid your oil pan will hit the rear I-beam pivot bracket. A guy over at the Rangerstation tried to use my El Cheapo mounts and had this very problem. He ended up just making a few little spacers and everything fit fine, but he recommended that anybody else just use the flat plates off the 2.9L mounts w/o lowering them in the engine cradle like I did. Hop over there and check it out.

Aha! http://www.geocities.com/coronetranger/index3.htm

Yeah, I'm quick like that :rolleyes:

I dunno, I kinda like it..........it's simple. I'm definitely gonna try it. On one hand I'd like the motor low for COG but OTOH I'll have full-width running gear so the truck should be pretty stable regardless.

I think I'm the only guy here with AA plates, so I'll say I like them and yeah, the motor sits way back.

No need to flame. Not much of that on this particular board. Welcome.

I'd recommend the 'vert mounts, but that is all I have experience with. I do know that they will get your engine as low down and as far back as you need to go.

Pros of the vert mounts are:
- they're cheap & readily available.
- mine took me 1/2 hour to install, once I had them bolted to the motor and marked the crossmember.
- You can upgrade to any aftermarket Mustang mount.
- The way they're designed, even if the rubber would fail, you won't have a motor flopping around in your engine compartment.
- There is no fabricating, other than drilling a couple holes in the crossmember.


Driver side.
http://www.smalltowncustoms.com/truck/5.0%20swap%20in%20progress/thumbs/tn_med_DriverSideMountInstalled.JPG

Passenger side.
http://www.smalltowncustoms.com/truck/5.0%20swap%20in%20progress/thumbs/tn_med_PassengerSideMountInstalled.JPG

Holes slotted for mounts. (large elongated holes near top of crossmember)
http://www.smalltowncustoms.com/truck/5.0%20swap%20in%20progress/thumbs/tn_med_MustangMountHolesSlotted.JPG


Or, you could spend $150+ on set of L&L mounts, the only advantage being that they will set your engine back another inch.

Good luck!
with the L&L mounts you wouldn't have to hack the hell out of your crossmember like this. mine bolted right in and sit squarley on the crossmember and don't over hang like the stang mounts. well worth the money

:rolleyes:

Hacked? Two holes, 5/8" x 1-1/2". $30 vs $150+

Easy decision.

:rolleyes:

Hacked? Two holes, 5/8" x 1-1/2". $30 vs $150+

Easy decision.

Amen.

If I didn't get the L&L cheap I would run the mustang mounts......... hell I still drilled my crossmember to get the motor farther back and lower.

I bought vert mounts first . Lowered the engine in and started scratching my head like how the hell is thing suppose to bolt in. So i sold those and bought L&L mounts..BIG mistake. Cost me like 160 Bucks. The holes in the mounts were wrong so the engine was sitting with the trans mount 3 inches off center. So i redrilled that mount. Then It broke on me. I didnt even drive the thing and it broke. So i had to modify it to work. Overall i would do it with vert mounts. especially after seeing Kevins pics which show me exactly what i would have needed to do 6 months ago. NATE

My L&L's fit like a glove. Not sure if they were worth the money but they have a lifetime warranty.

Holes slotted for mounts. (large elongated holes near top of crossmember)http://www.smalltowncustoms.com/truck/5.0%20swap%20in%20progress/thumbs/tn_med_MustangMountHolesSlotted.JPG

So I've been thinking (never good) about this a bit more. I'll have a 3" body lift which will in theory perhaps allow me to get the motor back a little further.....and Kevin it looks like you're nearly maxed out on slotting for the passenger side mount. So it seems with plates I *might* have an easier time getting the motor even further back than you did........which I think will be important because I hope to use a '90s truck serp FEAD (not really compact).

Of course this is all in theory, I still haven't actually touched the truck yet.....and things never play out how I envision.

Yes, that slot is maxed out. I would have gone further back, but needed to leave room for the big bolt underneath.

Using plates would probably get your engine further back, but my guess is that it'd sit up pretty high too. Seeing as how your truck is already lifted, I'd want to get that engine as low down as possible, for a lower center of gravity.

I don't know if I'd be worried about using the truck FEAD. I just measured the work truck, a 92 or 93 F150, and the front dress looks to be about ~8 - 8-1/2"
No longer than my Crown Vic front dress.
Read this (http://www.rangerpowersports.com/forum/showthread.php?t=147253) thread for more info about getting the rad under the core support. (refers to 95+ trucks, but the info should be of some use to you anyway.)

Kevin

**Edit** Just re-read your post. Another thing to consider: If you have to use the smog pump you'll be hard pressed to get it further back than I have. I have about 1" beween the firewall and each head this way. I'm not using the smog pump, but I could if I wanted to. (need room for crossover tube)

I made my own mounts, granted I am using a Mustang II crossmember and couldnt find anything else, but mine work well and cost me only welding wire, gas and metal I had sitting in a bin. you can kinda see them in my SSM profile http://streetsourcemag.com/viewownerprofile.aspx?profileid=33970

I just used some 1x3 box tubing, tubing notcher and some 3/4" round stock and a gusset

D60 If you use plates, I also have the dimensions for them with the 2.9L mounts in the stock location, as that is what I originally made. The plates are wider that the 'El Cheapos' are.

D60 If you use plates, I also have the dimensions for them with the 2.9L mounts in the stock location, as that is what I originally made. The plates are wider that the 'El Cheapos' are.

Stock location vs ?? lowered position?

Kevin, no need to worry about thermactor, it's all gone.

It's just that I've been reading and it seems one of the top three problems, if not the #1 problem with this swap, is radiator to fan clearance for most people. I'm worried about cooling as this will see crawling in potential hot, dry air..........so very little air movement but considerable load on the motor... more load than idling anyway. And I'm gonna retain a/c and I sure don't mind running it while on the trail :) (never been a problem in my fs Bronco).

At this point I'm thinking shove the motor as far back as possible with the body lift until the valve covers hit. Locate it there. Mark the firewall. Remove motor. Use BFH to give valve covers 1/2" clearance or so. Reinstall motor :)

I sure wouldn't mind being able to run a stock 351 clutch fan, but I may be dreaming...............back to that whole "in my head" vs reality thing.

If you want to go that far back then I'd think plates would be your only option.

I had thought about putting some plates between the 'vert mounts and the block, (in order to slide the motor back further than what the 'vert mounts alone will allow) but that wouldn't work. The plate on the driver side would interfere with the oil filter relocator.

Kevin

I don't think a body lift is gonna allow you to move the motor back any furhter than what Kevin's pics show.

I don't think a body lift is gonna allow you to move the motor back any furhter than what Kevin's pics show.

You could very well be right. I'm basically a "web motor swapper" at this point

You could always relocate the radiator to the bed like I will and keep the condensor in front. I know my 460 is going to take up every bit of the Ranger engine compartment so I'll have no choice.

I am the guy that had the problem w/ the plate mounts from that EL CHEAPO mount website............You can check out my webpage to see what I ran into and what I had to do. I HIHGLY suggest to you to keep the mounts in the stock location and make some plates, you shouldn't have any problems that way and you can slot the holes in the plates to put the motor as far forward/backword as you want! that 3" body lift will eliminate the need to have the motor that low so you can have room for your a/c box. good luck get ahold of me if you have any more questions. My engine is far enough forward so that I can reach the tranny bolts from the engine bay and I am using a 3.75" thick perma cool electric fan. but my radiator is really far forward, check it out......
ps-while ur making the plates build a torque limiter into it like i did....pics on the wepage

guess u need my webpage huh......page 8
http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/289637

i am not quite sure how much more you would want to go back with the engine. i had to dimple the firewall on the driverside to get proper clearance between the head and firewall (with l&l and no drilling.)

I am the guy that had the problem w/ the plate mounts from that EL CHEAPO mount website............You can check out my webpage to see what I ran into and what I had to do. I HIHGLY suggest to you to keep the mounts in the stock location and make some plates, you shouldn't have any problems that way and you can slot the holes in the plates to put the motor as far forward/backword as you want! that 3" body lift will eliminate the need to have the motor that low so you can have room for your a/c box. good luck get ahold of me if you have any more questions.

ps-while ur making the plates build a torque limiter into it like i did....pics on the wepage

guess u need my webpage huh......page 8
http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/289637

Thanks for the info but wasn't your clearance issue with the pivot arm? I'll have an SAS so that wont' be a concern. Thanks for the pics, they kinda create as many questions as they answer. The text says you lowered the motor 1.5" but then it looks like you used spacers in the pics to raise it up some off the plates?