I have a 99 Ranger 2wd...I just did the front brakes this weekend. I got the rotors turned, bought and packed new bearings, lubed the caliper slides. Everything was fine.....then this morning I heard this horrible groan/scrape/grind coming from the front driver side, and I could feel it a little in my brake pedal. I pulled the tire off, pulled the caliper off, checked the rotor and pads, and everything appears to be fine, yet it still makes this noise occaisonally. Anyone know what the hell is going on? The truck doesn't pull to one side or anything, but I'm noticing excessive brake dust on both front wheels (probably due to new pads).

Any info will help. Thanks.
Chris

I have done this before where the Pins are installed upside down. I can't remember if the new one has those or not.

Pins....? Caliper slide pins? Let me know what you're thinking here...and how bad it is to drive this way.

Anyone know what is actually making that god awful sound?

Thanks!
Chris

Newer calipers are held in place by two small bolts on the back of the spindle. Not sure what could be causing the grinding noise. You might check to see if the disc guard has been bent slightly and rubbing against the disc as it turns. I do find it hard to believe your bearings needed to be replaced on a 99 though.

Well the truck has 60k miles on it. I work 55 miles from home.....so I figured I'd throw new bearings in there while I had it all apart. Could the grinding be caused by improperly packed bearings?

Oh yeah, the splash plate behind the rotor is not bent, and I only hear&feel the grinding when breaking.

Hmm. Well, there really isnt a way to improperly pack the bearings, unless you either dont put any, or only put jsut a little bit of grease in. One possibilty is that you got some pads that have a little hight metal content, and you've driven the truck enough that the pads have just started to wear a little, and youve hit a hard spot in the pad. Its normal for that to happen, even tho it is kind of annoying and unnerving.

Well I just checked them a little bit ago, and the wear doesn't seem excessive. So, I guess it's just something I'll deal with and keep an eye on in the future. Thanks for all the help!

Chris

Well, the wear doesnt have to be excesive. You could wear off a very small amount of the pad surface to expose a peice of metal in the pad. My suggestion is to drive it around for a few weeks. If it doesnt go away, you might want to consider changing the pads again. What brand of pad are you using?

Yep it may be the pads need time to settle in. Since it happens only when you're braking it's probably not the bearings.

rondel - you know alittle i see about the pins on 4x4 vehicles. 99 ranger. well did mine used heavy duty pads that my girlfriend got from her work. they make them. msd652. i think that was the product #. Well mine dont make a noise which i believe is this gentlemens problem is the pads do have alot of metal in them causing them to squeal. I they dont stop then time to replace. WEll my quetion to anyone here is on the pins how mush side to side motion can you have on the pins. i lubed them and they seem to slide in and out with out binding but i am confussed on the tolerance they should have. seems one side has less then the other and on the other tire side same thing. and how the hell are you supposed to remove the bushings? flat screw driver and hammer? OR what? everything so far looks good except that concern. ohh i just remembered for the guy with the squealing pads. i beleive they should have had the silicon high temp grease put on the back of the pads which cause them also to run quietter.

Check for grease or brake fluid on the pads. They will grab like hell and groan if you have any on them at all. And the stuff that goes on the back of the pads to stop squealing is a high temp silicone adhesive, not a grease. :)

Haha....funny you say that, because when I compressed the caliper, some fluid dripped out of the resivoir and got on the rotor (and pads probably). Well the same day, after the pad change, I was driving and when I applied the brake, smoke billowed out of the wheel well. I freaked out and later came to find out that it was only the fluid burning off of the rotor....hehe

So now the possible causes are:
Fluid on the pads/rotor
Pads not broken in yet
Too much metal in pads

I guess I should have paid the etra $30 and got the Raybestos QuietStop pads instead of the Autozone cheapies. Oh yeah, I almost forgot, I did use Hi-Temp Silicone for the caliper slides. This is about the 20th brake job I've done since I started driving 8 yrs ago.....I've just never run into this prob before.

Thanks so much for all the help guys.

Originally posted by RangerSVTSplash
WEll my quetion to anyone here is on the pins how mush side to side motion can you have on the pins. i lubed them and they seem to slide in and out with out binding but i am confussed on the tolerance they should have. seems one side has less then the other and on the other tire side same thing. and how the hell are you supposed to remove the bushings? flat screw driver and hammer? OR what?

I wouldn't be too concerned about the tolerances as long as they don't slide out on their own. When you say bushings do you mean the pins that attach the caliper to the spindle? My calipers are attached with the bolt's so I'm not all that familiar with the pins. As I recall, a friend of mine with the pins did exactly as you described with the screwdriver and hammer.

Did you adjust your back brakes at the same time to ensure even distribution to all 4 wheels? The new fronts are considerably thicker than the ones you replaced and sometimes they will be doing all the breaking until worn down some. Might cause excess noise, might not.

RD

Originally posted by Rangerdog
Did you adjust your back brakes at the same time to ensure even distribution to all 4 wheels? The new fronts are considerably thicker than the ones you replaced and sometimes they will be doing all the breaking until worn down some. Might cause excess noise, might not.

RD

Doesn't the proportioning valve take care of distributing the braking duties between front and rear?

That's what I'm thinking. I don't see how you can have any control over the braking distribution. How would you "adjust" them?

Well it is supposed to but I have just found that there is usually so much slop in the rears that they don't fully engage, and if you don't back up much the self adjuster doesn't adjust. Its just SOP for changing fronts to inspect and adjust the rears.

RD

I wanted to check the rears, but I didn't know how to get the damn drums off. The Haynes manual said something about needing a brake tool to get it off, but it was noon, and about 90 degrees and a trillion percent humidity outside, and I lost my patience very fast. Any pointers would be greatly appreciated.

Chris

I just replaced the front brakes and bearings on my 2000 with 30,000 miles. The shim on the inside pad on the drivers side came unglued and wore a groove on the rotor. I put everything back together and it was only stopping on the new front pads. So I adjusted the rear brakes by:

1.) removing the rubber plug on the back of the backing plate.

2.) inserting a brake spoon to release the retainer on the star wheel inside.

3.) insert a screwdriver at the same time to turn the star wheel.

4.) have someone turn the wheel at the same time you are turning the star until the wheel has a little friction on it.

It seems complicated but its fairly easy. I had the same problem with the smoke after I first drove the truck.

What in the bejeezus is a brake spoon?

Originally posted by butter428
What in the bejeezus is a brake spoon?

A specialized tool for working on brakes, especially drum brakes. Any local parts store carries it.

Inside the brake assembly, there is a little adjusting mechanism. It has a star wheel on it. You pull the drum off, and use the brake spoon to turn the star wheel. As the star wheel is turned, it will either move the brake shoes farther out, or closer to the center. What you want is for the drums to be snug, but not tight. You should be able to remove the drums, or put them back on, or be able to spin the wheel, with a whole lot of effort.

You can do it without removing the wheel through the hole in the back if the drum under the truck.

A couple of last tidbits of info. The rear drums are sometimes very difficult to get off if they've been on there a while. The brakes leave a ridge on the drums which keeps them from pulling over the shoes. Most of the time you will need to release the rear shoes a little to get the drum off. Best thing to get the drum off with is a drum puller because it pulls evenly around the drum. Pulling from the outside edges with a couple screwdrivers forces the hole around the axle to dig in and makes it even more difficult to get off.

The proportioning valve allows more pressure to be applied to the front discs than it does the rear drums, it won't compensate for drums that are out of adjustment. I always at least check the adjustment on the rear drums whenever I change the front pads just to be sure they are within adjustment. It's also very common for the rear wheel adjusters to freeze up and stop self adjusting, which throws more of the stopping effort on the front discs.

I adjust the rear drums by jacking the wheel off the ground (use jack stands too) and cranking the adjusters out until the wheel won't turn by hand. This ensures that the brake shoes are centered. I then back them off a notch or two at a time until the wheel turns with just a little bit of drag from the shoes. There's usually a high spot on the drum somewhere that makes a little noise as you rotate the wheel and it hits the shoes.

Originally posted by MazdaSOHC
A couple of last tidbits of info. The rear drums are sometimes very difficult to get off if they've been on there a while. The brakes leave a ridge on the drums which keeps them from pulling over the shoes. Most of the time you will need to release the rear shoes a little to get the drum off. Best thing to get the drum off with is a drum puller because it pulls evenly around the drum. Pulling from the outside edges with a couple screwdrivers forces the hole around the axle to dig in and makes it even more difficult to get off.

The proportioning valve allows more pressure to be applied to the front discs than it does the rear drums, it won't compensate for drums that are out of adjustment. I always at least check the adjustment on the rear drums whenever I change the front pads just to be sure they are within adjustment. It's also very common for the rear wheel adjusters to freeze up and stop self adjusting, which throws more of the stopping effort on the front discs.

I adjust the rear drums by jacking the wheel off the ground (use jack stands too) and cranking the adjusters out until the wheel won't turn by hand. This ensures that the brake shoes are centered. I then back them off a notch or two at a time until the wheel turns with just a little bit of drag from the shoes. There's usually a high spot on the drum somewhere that makes a little noise as you rotate the wheel and it hits the shoes.

I feel....vindicated!! :) Actually this was a very good discussion and more of the type needed on here!

RD

Originally posted by MazdaSOHC
Check for grease or brake fluid on the pads. They will grab like hell and groan if you have any on them at all. And the stuff that goes on the back of the pads to stop squealing is a high temp silicone adhesive, not a grease. :)

That's probably my problem! I replaced my front pads about 2-3 weeks ago and I'm having the same groaning problem. I kept pulling the front tires off and nothing looked wrong. I think I put too much grease when I re-packed the bearings and I've been noticing it start to come out of the center cap on the wheel. More than likely some got on the pads then.....

And they do grab like hell, now that I think about it. Any ideas on how to clean the pads?

Originally posted by Highwayman


That's probably my problem! I replaced my front pads about 2-3 weeks ago and I'm having the same groaning problem. I kept pulling the front tires off and nothing looked wrong. I think I put too much grease when I re-packed the bearings and I've been noticing it start to come out of the center cap on the wheel. More than likely some got on the pads then.....

And they do grab like hell, now that I think about it. Any ideas on how to clean the pads?

You can use a couple of things. Rubbing alcohol works pretty good, spray on brake cleaner works better. In a pinch lacquer thinner will do the job. After you clean them, use some 60 or coarser sand paper to remove a little of the surface. If you use the brake cleaner, go ahead and pull the pads as it won't get in to clean the grease very well if they are on the truck. Clean the rotor off too. They should be back to the "new" light gray after the cleaning and sanding. Grease comes off OK, but if you leave brake fluid on them for long it saturates the pads and you're better off changing them.

The groaning could be coming from the rears being out of adjustment, and the fronts trying to do most of the braking. New pads stop better than the old ones after they have broken in a little.

I'm with everyone else... if it wasn't doing it at first, I'd check the rears... if everything is working properly from the factory, they should wear pretty evenly front and rear...

You'll need to adjust the star adjuster before you can remove the drum... it takes some patience, a steady hand, and the right tool for the job, but it's usually not too bad. I've never needed to use a drum puller, but I also used to inspect and degrease the rear drums every tire rotation.

Let us know what you find...

-Joe-

if you sand the pads, don't breathe the dust!

Originally posted by Black_Jack
if you sand the pads, don't breathe the dust!

Come on Black_Jack, they took out asbestos years ago. They use silica in them now, which isn't good to breath but it won't give you cancer. Never hurts to wear a dust mask anyway, but I haven't figured out how to smoke a cigarette and wear one at the same time. :smoke:

wasn't aware - sorry, haven't been on the up and up with brake pad materials :) doesn't smoking kinda defeat the purpose of a mask anyways, no? :afro:

Originally posted by Black_Jack
doesn't smoking kinda defeat the purpose of a mask anyways, no? :afro:


Kinda, but I look at it as extra filter material. Can't be too safe. :nuts: